Match in trade needs - What offer do i put on table

[MaestroJay]

10 team H2H

Owner is looking for a 2B,3B, and Ofer which I can offer.He has the of bat, starting pitching, and closers I desire.However, to get atleast 1 of the 3 I am probably going to have to put a package deal on the table.Which for me is a disadvantage in terms of them short term valuing what i am offering, as not a lot of my "throw in pieces" are hot right now.

Any advice on an offer to put on table, or am I better off waiting until I see what Jennings looks like coming off the DL?

Me:

C - Weiters
1B - Teixeira
2B - Phillips
SS - Tulowitzki
3B - Hanley
OF - Granderson/Heyward/De Aza/Pagan
UTIL - Moustakas
BN - Freeman/Craig/Altuve
DL - Jennings

SP - Bumgarner/Greinke
RP - Casilla/Soriano
P - Frieri/Paulino/Morrow/Garcia

Him:

C - Ruiz
1B - Fielder
2B - Infante
SS - Hardy
3B - Headley
OF - Hart/CarGo/Swisher/Dirks
UTIL - LaRoche
BN - Pierzynski
DL - Pablo

SP - Weaver/Price
RP - Johnson/Perez
P - Putz/Reed/Wilson/Francisco
BN - Lester/G.Gonzalez

[Captain Hook]

I would just wait until you see what happens with Jennings - you have too good a team to dissemble it for the wrong reasons - two closers now with Casilla and Soriano; Tex starting to hit a little; ditto Phillips and Tulo.

If you need (?) more saves see if Cishek (MIA) or any of the Washington committee (Clippard, Burnett, Stammen) are available

[Todd Zola]

For saves, also take a peak at Tom Wilhelmsen - League is still scuffling and the post-game comments were a little vague.

[MaestroJay]

Offensively, since Pagan and De Aza are still hitting, mainly looking for a consistant/hot util bat since Freeman is seemingly going blind, and neither Altuve or Moustakas are consistant.Won't have Jennings or Craig until this time next week at the earliest (only way I can keep both is if I drop someone else, as someone has to be dropped to get Jennings off of DL slot).

Looking at wire - Kipnis and Willingham are clearing waivers tomorrow, and Harper,C.Davis,J.Lowrie are clearing by wednesday. Francoeur,Vicideo,Morgan are available as well. Austin Jackson was just dropped because he's on dl, won't clear wire for another couple of days though.

Any of those better than Freeman/Moustakas/Altuve? Statistically speaking, I don't need 1 area of improvement, just trying to fill the Util hole with something consistant.

Pitching wise I need ratio help guys that can either get K's or wins.As for saves, its really a week by week thing can't tell without seeing the matchup how many i'll need.

SP on wire that may fits that bill to some degree - Kuroda/Floyd/E.Santana/Jackson/Billingsley/Nolasco/Dempster(waivers until 28th)/Masterson/Bedard

RP on wire that may fit that bill - Uehara/Romo/Clippard/Adams/Ogando/Marshall

So there are some non trade options but then it boils down to who on my team is droppable.

[Todd Zola]

For saves, also take a peak at Tom Wilhelmsen - League is still scuffling and the post-game comments were a little vague.

DING!!

[Captain Hook]

Offensively, since Pagan and De Aza are still hitting, mainly looking for a consistant/hot util bat since Freeman is seemingly going blind, and neither Altuve or Moustakas are consistant.Won't have Jennings or Craig until this time next week at the earliest (only way I can keep both is if I drop someone else, as someone has to be dropped to get Jennings off of DL slot).

Looking at wire - Kipnis and Willingham are clearing waivers tomorrow, and Harper,C.Davis,J.Lowrie are clearing by wednesday. Francoeur,Vicideo,Morgan are available as well. Austin Jackson was just dropped because he's on dl, won't clear wire for another couple of days though.

Any of those better than Freeman/Moustakas/Altuve? Statistically speaking, I don't need 1 area of improvement, just trying to fill the Util hole with something consistant.

Pitching wise I need ratio help guys that can either get K's or wins.As for saves, its really a week by week thing can't tell without seeing the matchup how many i'll need.

SP on wire that may fits that bill to some degree - Kuroda/Floyd/E.Santana/Jackson/Billingsley/Nolasco/Dempster(waivers until 28th)/Masterson/Bedard

RP on wire that may fit that bill - Uehara/Romo/Clippard/Adams/Ogando/Marshall

So there are some non trade options but then it boils down to who on my team is droppable.

I am not an overall fan of Kuroda pitching in Yankee stadium this year....BUT next week he has a tasty two starts - home vs KC and @ OAK

After today I am not sure Kipnis will clear very easily

[MaestroJay]

What kind of drop leash do Altuve,Freeman and Moustakas have at this point and who gets the nod at util?

When Craig and Jennings get off the DL, who do I drop to keep both on roster? Or do i not keep both and drop Craig, in which case why not drop Craig for something now, and drop that something when Jennings gets off DL?

[Captain Hook]

1) What kind of drop leash do Altuve,Freeman and Moustakas have at this point and who gets the nod at util?

2) When Craig and Jennings get off the DL, who do I drop to keep both on roster? Or do i not keep both and drop Craig, in which case why not drop Craig for something now, and drop that something when Jennings gets off DL?

1) Neither Altuve or Moustakas are coming out of the lineup. Freeman's spot is at this point soley dependent on health issues. I would go with Altuve this week with three games in Colorado and three at home vs Cincy

2a) You shouldn't even think about dropping Craig (well not until the next injury anyway)
2b) You make the decision on who goes for Jennings WHEN that happens and you have more information - again I doubt you want to drop him if he is playing every day but cross that bridge when you get to it.

[MaestroJay]

I was able to get Kipnis off of waivers for Paulino.This leaves me with a 2B surplus, and an open P slot. Who is droppable at this point of Freeman,Altuve,Craig,Moustakas and Kipnis? Say droppable since short of Altuve and Kipnis none of my bench/util options are healthy/hitting.Unless I were to manage a Phillips trade for a pitcher, I have no way to get both Altuve and Kipnis in lineup as is.

C - Weiters
1B - Teixeira
2B - Phillips
SS - Tulowitzki
3B - Hanley
OF - Granderson/Heyward/De Aza/Pagan
UTIL - Altuve
BN - Freeman/Craig/Moustakas/Kipnis
DL - Jennings

SP - Bumgarner/Greinke
RP - Casilla/Soriano
P - Frieri/Morrow/Garcia

[Captain Hook]

I would definitely try and trade Brandon Phillips for a pitcher

Even Phillips and Moustakas (or an OF) for a good pitcher would seem to help your roadblock

[MaestroJay]

The problem is trades take a couple of days and to fill the empty P slot by 5/28 someone has to be dropped today.

Maybe drop Freeman or Craig (Freeman bit riskier but a 1B having eye problems and missing time for it doesn't seem promising, and small chance I could pick Craig back up down road) for a 2 start streamer (w/k/era help) or a rp (era/whip help) who'd get dropped when Jennings gets off DL. This gives me a week to work out a trade, and don't lose any OF depth taking Jennings off of DL if he struggles right away.

SP on wire - Kuroda/Floyd/E.Santana/Diamond/Lincoln/Paulino
/Miley/Pettite/Burnett/Zambrano/Maholm/Smyly/Wei-Yen

RP on wire - Uehara/Romo/Clippard/Adams/Ogando/Marshall/
Pestarno/Downs/Burnett/Wilhelmsen/Robertson

[Captain Hook]

The problem is trades take a couple of days and to fill the empty P slot by 5/28 someone has to be dropped today.

Maybe drop Freeman or Craig (Freeman bit riskier but a 1B having eye problems and missing time for it doesn't seem promising, and small chance I could pick Craig back up down road) for a 2 start streamer (w/k/era help) or a rp (era/whip help) who'd get dropped when Jennings gets off DL. This gives me a week to work out a trade, and don't lose any OF depth taking Jennings off of DL if he struggles right away.

SP on wire - Kuroda/Floyd/E.Santana/Diamond/Lincoln/Paulino
/Miley/Pettite/Burnett/Zambrano/Maholm/Smyly/Wei-Yen

RP on wire - Uehara/Romo/Clippard/Adams/Ogando/Marshall/
Pestarno/Downs/Burnett/Wilhelmsen/Robertson

Not sure why trades would take a couple of days? Pick up the phone and make a trade

But absent that I would drop Freeman and pick up Kuroda

Again, IMO you should not be dropping Craig

[MaestroJay]

It's a yahoo public league, trades take a couple of days to go through.

I was just offered Gallardo for Phillips Is Gallarado good enough to be "the pitcher" I need to get via trade in general? Or could i get a better pitcher for Phillips maybe Hamels or Haren here?

His pitchers - Hamels,Haren,Aceves,Guerra,Darvish,Gallarado,Beachy,Porcello,Moore

Still have to drop someone for tomorrow either way.

[Captain Hook]

It's a yahoo public league, trades take a couple of days to go through.

I was just offered Gallardo for Phillips Is Gallarado good enough to be "the pitcher" I need to get via trade in general? Or could i get a better pitcher for Phillips maybe Hamels or Haren here?

His pitchers - Hamels,Haren,Aceves,Guerra,Darvish,Gallarado,Beachy,Porcello,Moore

Still have to drop someone for tomorrow either way.

You are NOT getting Hamels or Haren for Phillips
I would take Gallardo for Phillips.....the only alternative would be to offer him another player (assuming he has the need for an outfielder) for H or H but if he is not interested get Gallardo

and again I would drop Freeman who still hasn't solved the problems with his eyes (much less with his bat)

[AllstonRockCity]

I would take beachy or darvish over gallardo. IMO he's offering you his 5th best starter. Might as well try to get his 3 or 4 since the captain is right and you aren't getting his 1 or 2.

[MaestroJay]

This is his offense don't know how else we'd match. Only spot may be the Boesh OF slot, which until Craig or Jennings get off DL I can't offer due to no healthy OF plugin.

C - Avila
1B - Pujols
2B - Johnson
SS - Furcal
3B - Freese
OF - Bruce,Stubbs,Cuddyer,Boesch
UTIL - Wright
BN - Zimmerman/Rollins
DL - Longoria

Looking at other owner trading blocks there are some other SP options.

Halladay/Sabathia/Lilly/Shields owner is looking for a 2B and has those under available players
Weaver/Gio/Jim Johnson/Perez/Putz/Reed/Wilson/Francisco/Price/Lester is looking for 2B/3B/OF

With Kuroda pick up I don't "have to" make a trade today. Really just boils down to finding best return for me while keeping some OF depth just incase Craig or Jennings slow out of gate.

Do you like accepting Gallarado for Phillips or exploring Phillips/Moose packages with Gio/Weaver owner, or checking with Halladay/Sabathia owner about Shields? Or is my best bet waiting until Craig and Phillips get off DL?

[Captain Hook]

This is his offense don't know how else we'd match. Only spot may be the Boesh OF slot, which until Craig or Jennings get off DL I can't offer due to no healthy OF plugin.

C - Avila
1B - Pujols
2B - Johnson
SS - Furcal
3B - Freese
OF - Bruce,Stubbs,Cuddyer,Boesch
UTIL - Wright
BN - Zimmerman/Rollins
DL - Longoria

Looking at other owner trading blocks there are some other SP options.

Halladay/Sabathia/Lilly/Shields owner is looking for a 2B and has those under available players
Weaver/Gio/Jim Johnson/Perez/Putz/Reed/Wilson/Francisco/Price/Lester is looking for 2B/3B/OF

With Kuroda pick up I don't "have to" make a trade today. Really just boils down to finding best return for me while keeping some OF depth just incase Craig or Jennings slow out of gate.

Do you like accepting Gallarado for Phillips or exploring Phillips/Moose packages with Gio/Weaver owner, or checking with Halladay/Sabathia owner about Shields? Or is my best bet waiting until Craig and Phillips get off DL?

1) try for Weaver or Gio
2) try for Shields
3) accept Gallardo offer
4) wait without improving team

[MaestroJay]

Phillips for Shields?
Phillips/Moose for Weaver or Gio?

Player valuation for trades is a weakness for me.

[Captain Hook]

Phillips for Shields?
Phillips/Moose for Weaver or Gio?

Player valuation for trades is a weakness for me.

Not sure why.....Which one do YOU like better? That is really the essence....my order would be

Weaver
Gio
Shields

[MaestroJay]

Mean valuation in terms of what it takes to get what,not who to go after.

[da_big_kid_94]

Ok ...I've been looking at this thread for a while now .... allow me to say what I believe Perry and Todd are trying to convey. Take a shot. What's the worst that can happen ...the other guy says no? You are asking people about what to do as if they were the other guy - and they aren't. Their valuations mean zip. YOUR valuations mean only slightly more in as much as what you feel you can safely give up. The KEY valuation(s) is your trade partner. What does he feel the players you covet are worth? We really don't know what his motivation(s) is/are ... so go fishing. You won't get many bites if you don't drop the line in the water and analysis paralysis can be deadly in this game.

Make an offer ... it may turn out to be the starting point of a negotiation. if not, and he doesn't want to deal under any circumstances, saves you time and you can make efforts in other arenas.

[Captain Hook]

Mean valuation in terms of what it takes to get what,not who to go after.

But that is not a valuation - it is determined by the other team, not your view.
Beauty (need vs want) is in the eye of the beholder - just like some might prefer strawberry over vanilla when they both cost the same (and play the same position)

[da_big_kid_94]

Wow ....vuja de ....I mean ...deja vu.

[AllstonRockCity]

Somtimes your cards ain't worth a dime if you don't lay em down

Name that Dead song

[MaestroJay]

Gio/Weaver is a no, owner doesn't have an interest in Phillips - Why would I give up a top teir pitcher for a second basemen with those #'s off the FA list. (he has Infante at 2B and is seemingly overvaluing his hot start)

Haven't heard back from Sabathia/Shields owner.

Do I go ahead and accept Yovani Gallardo,counter with an offer for possibly beachy/darvish or wait for the Sabathia/Shields owner response.Don't want to lose value because I just don't need Phillips, but if he's only valued as a FA replacement is there much i can do.

[Captain Hook]

Just trade Phillips for Gallardo

PS - just because one owner thinks Phillips is the same as the best FA 2b doesn't make it so - outside his head anyway


But that owner illustrates my problem with trying to divine trades by yourself - IF you really want to succeed in making better trades I again humbly suggest....... Communication > you need to find out what different owners want not what you think they might want

[MaestroJay]

It's a yahoo free online public league (none of us know each other) so its email or league board communication .I do a lot of communication but get 0 response, only way I do is by the decline/acceptance of offers.Didn't even get a feeler when i let it be known I was shopping LaHair when he was hitting.

[Captain Hook]

Next year upgrade your choice of leagues

[MaestroJay]

After trade goes through on Thursday (presuming no veto), this is what my roster looks like, with Kuroda getting dropped when Jennings gets off DL Anything glaring you would look to improve now,or wait until I see what Jennings/Craig look like coming off of dl?

Only thing I'm looking at is Pagan who while hitting isn't stealing or hitting for power.Would going the Vicideo,Francouer,Willingham,Luke Scott route for a bit more power do anything? Or do I just keep Pagan until wheels fall off?

C - Weiters
1B - Teixeira
2B - Kipnis
SS - Tulo
3B - Hanley
OF - De Aza/Pagan/Heyward/Granderson
UTIL - Altuve
BN - Moustakas/Craig
DL - Jennings

SP - Greinke/Bumgarner
RP - Casilla/Frieri
P - Garcia/Morrow/Soriano/Kuroda
BN - Gallarado

[Captain Hook]

Pagan is NOT a power hitter so I would temper what sound like expectations for contributions there.

Frenchy is one of if not the hottest hitter in the game this week, so he would definitely be an upgrade over Pagan and KC plays CLE and OAK next week (Scott hasn't hit much lately but would be my distant second choice)

Otherwise I would just wait until you get your guys back

[MaestroJay]

Not expectations from Pagan, just looking at the speed vs power need based on roster changes and production potential of players on team.