2011 SECOND BASEMEN CONSENSUS RANKINGS

[Trav The Ump]

Please rank your top-12 two baggers using standard 5x5 rotisserie scoring rules (HR, BA, RBI, SB, R)

Feel free to provide commentary along with your picks.

Scoring will be done MVP style, your top double play turner will get 12 points.

If you want to give honorable mentions to those outside your Top 12, feel free. I'd also suggest you pick one dark horse who can shoot into your top 12 with the right luck etc.

After we receive enough votes, we'll post the results in a separate thread along with comparisons to other rankings systems.

Look forward to seeing everyone's lists and thoughts.

[Black Sox]

Here is mine...

For me 2B is one of my favorite positions this year. There are just soo many choices I like after the elite players are gone, and since most of elite carry some health risk, it's even easier to wait on this position and grab some studs elsewhere.

12 Cano, Robinson ( 1st round..... uh no )
11 Utley, Chase ( you sure he goes back to stud status? Willing to bet your season on it? )
10 Pedroia, Dustin ( screw in the foot = not touching in the 2nd round )
9 Kinsler, Ian ( DL waiting to happen, oh wait it does happen EVERY SINGLE YEAR )
8 Uggla, Dan ( Ugh )
9 Phillips, Brandon ( 3 year decline, paying for name here )
7 Hill, Aaron ( LOVE HIM this year - Hated him last year, it's all about the value )
6 Prado, Martin ( Solid )
5 Beckham, Gordon ( Started to figure things out, only get's better )
4 Johnson, Kelly ( Not a fluke, Not a Stud, but still solid late pick
3 Zobrist, Ben ( just think last year was basement for him )
2 Kendrick, Howie ( solid BA guy, you could do worse )
1 Weeks, Rickie

[deansdaddy]

I would like to point out that while we asked for your Top 12 for each position, these rankings should not be viewed as only for 12 team leagues. The order you would rank players at positions can be the same from format to format while the point you choose a certain player will change. So I would caution posters from making blanket statements about players with regard to the round you may or may not be able to draft a player. In a 15 team league I think Cano (and Tulowitski at SS) are solid 1st round choices. In 12 team leagues, Cano very well may slide to the 2nd round. Still view these rankings lists more as a general view of the order you would rank them regardless of league format.

[Black Sox]

Good point Ryan, should have avoided the round comments.

[deansdaddy]

Hey man - no sweat. I do the same thing only usually toward the 15 team format. It makes sense when you prep for particular formats that it colors your thoughts on certain players.

Funny - I re-read your comments again and laughed. I can see you are waiting this year. Actually, I don't blame you and in my two early 15 team drafts I waited on 2B both times. In one draft I came away with T Nishioka and in the other I got G Beckham (who was my target in both once I decided to wait). I agree with your thinking, and if I had to choose one position to wait on in this year's draft it would be 2B. I do like both Cano, Utley and Pedroia and if my draft unfolds in a way that choosing them makes sense I wouldn't hesitate grabbing either on of those three early. But I agree 2B seems like the scarce position that has the most depth this year.

[Mickey4081]

1. Cano
2. Utley
3. Pedroia
4. Kinsler- who knows what he's capable of if this s.o.b. could just stay off the dl.
5. Phillips- still has the ability to post 20/20
6. Weeks
7. Uggla
8. Roberts
9. Prado
10. Johnson
11. Beckham- Hit's in a very good lineup in a great hitters park. Could post .275 with 20 dingers
12. Hill

[cwk1963]

1. Cano - could very well win a batting title or MVP one of these years.
2. Kinsler - I like his ballpark and lineup a bit better than Utley and he's also younger.
3. Utley - I believe he's on the down side. Watch out for the latest health issue.
4. Pedroia - The screws in his foot worry me and I won't be owning him but he's better than the rest.
5. Uggla - his power will be helped with the move to Turner Field.
6. Weeks - I'm betting he has another full season healthy and that puts him ahead of...
7. Phillips - If he hits leadoff will get additional SB at the expense of RBI but better suited lower in the lineup.
8. Hill - Yeah, the BA was a bummer but that will come back and if 26 HR is a down year I'll take it.
9. Zobrist - Like the combination power and speed. I don't think he flirts with .300 again but split the difference from last year.
10. Johnson - I like 2B that can hit HR. 26 may be too much to ask for but I like him for 20.
11. Kendrick - I still think the breakout is coming.
12. Walker - Mid-teens power. Won't be spectacular but is young enough to improve a bit.

Roberts - I can't include him because we don't know where the next injury is coming from. Last year it was back. And knee. And hip. And he's 33 and not getting any younger. You get the picture.

[AllstonRockCity]

1 Cano - i always kind of expected last season, but it was a year too late for me, so i believe he continues on a similar pace
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2 Utley - just a great hitter
3 Kinsler - I have a feeling he stays relatively healthy this year and pays off nicely
4 Pedroia - I just don't see as many AB this year as in the past, limiting his value
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5 Uggla - a guy I have never believed in. if I don't change that now, I never will
6 Phillips - getting to the age where you wonder if he has peaked and you need to look at what he actually provided and not what he might
7 Weeks - risky, with risk comes reward and 2B is weird this year
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8 Beckham - yes, that's right. i believe. i think CHI has a ridiculous lineup and he should hit 2nd in it. i think .285 22 85, 85 13 type numbers are easily within reach
9 Prado - love the AVG and the AB potential
10 Hill - if he traded some power for some AVG he'd be higher up the list
11 Johnson - figures to hit in a good lineup spot
12 Zobrist - he was maybe the most debated and tough to predict player on these boards 1 year ago, he showed us why
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Roberts (when your primary asset is speed and you are 33 with mounting injuries, i avoid you) Kendrick, Walker

[deansdaddy]

Here's my Top 12 at 2B for this year:

1.) Robinson Cano - He has staked his claim to the top spot after a tremendous 2010 season. The Yanks moved him up to the 5-hole and the RBI's followed. He plays in a great lineup and a great home ballpark for his compact left-handed swing. The only drawback is he doesn't steal bases. He was SOOOO good in the 1st half, many didn't notice that he slumped a bit in the 2nd half. Still he's a safe bet to hit .300/100/25/100 again and a batting title is in the cards if he could sustain last year's 1st half h% for the entire year.
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2.) Dustin Pedroia - Pedroia was on his way to a career season when the foot injury struck. He is such a gamer, I don't see him missing a beat if the foot is healed. Todd Z pointed out that there is some risk with the inserted screw posing problems which could make getting that BA back above .300 a problem.

3.) Ian Kinsler - Kinsler is not a player for the risk averse. He has made multiple trips to the DL over the past few seasons. If not for similar injury concerns for Utley he would likely be lower on my list. It looks like Kinsler is set to be installed in the leadoff spot to start the year. If so, his SB's have a chance to shhot back up, with 30 again being within reach. His power really suffered last year, due to injury, but I expect that to rebound up to at least 20 this year.
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4.) Dan Uggla - Taking into account the risks involved with the names sandwiched around him, Uggla looks that much better this year. He's a virtual lock for 30 hr's and should enjoy hitting in Atlanta. I doubt he hits over .280 again, but I think he won't fall all the way down to his .240 days. If you draft him bank on the power and good health.

5.) Chase Utley - I have the benefit of writing this list after news of Utley's cortisone shot to the knee broke. It has definitely drove his price down already in drafts. At this point we don't even know if he will be ready to start the year. Even if he does tough it out, the knee means that the odds of him coming close to 20 sb's are very long. If he slips in drafts, I'll consider buying, but there will likely always be someone willing to take a chance.
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6.) Brandon Phillips - Last year was the first time Phillips didn't crack 20 HR's or SB's (or both) since he became a full-time player in 2006. He has been a model of good health though, so if you draft him you know at least he's going to give you plenty of AB's. Last year's numbers should supress his value enough that he will be a nice value for anyone waiting a bit at the position.

7.) Rickie Weeks - Weeks finally stayed healthy last year and repaid all those that gambled (again) that he could do it. So now the question is, "Do you feel lucky, PUNK?" I personally doubt that he can do it two years in a row. He'll provide power when healthy, but not as much speed as you probably think. If you do take the plunge, make sure to have a backup plan.
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8.) Ben Zobrist - Zobrist killed a lot of people who bought into his 2009 breakout. His power vanished and his BA was a team killer for a high pick. However, his sb's increased to 24 which was at least something. You could do a lot worse for yourself than grabbing a 20/20 2B after the big names are gone. Just don't expect him to hit .300 again anytime soon.

9.) Aaron Hill - His BA fell off a cliff last year, which will make him a good value and a guy to target this season. His power potential means he has a great shot to easily outperform his likely draft price.

10.) Kelly Johnson - Johnson had a very nice season for the Diamondbacks last year. He has good pop for a MI and chips in enough speed to help there as well. A solid pick in any format.
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11.) Martin Prado - This may end up being the last year we can slot Prado in at 2B, and that's too bad, since his numbers play a lot better there than they do at 3B or OF. He isn't flashy, but he will provide double-digit power and a stable average. I like him more as a MI, so you can take advantage of his multi-positional eligibility.

12.) Gordon Beckham - Beckham was 2010's sophomore slumper. All that means for you is he will go cheaper and later than he should. If you want to wait on a position this year, I think 2B is it and Beckham is a great guy to target in that case.

HM

13.) Neil Walker - I don't see any reason to believe that Walker won't improve upon last year's numbers.

14.) Howie Kendrick - I will say it up front, I am not a fan of Howie Kendrick. I just don't think he's ever going to be as good as people predicted he would be.

15.) Brian Roberts - I will give the gritty vet the last spot on my list. I doubt I will own him anywhere this year, but if he can stay on the field he will give you some pop and some speed. He just won't give you as much as he used to.

[Black Sox]

Hey man - no sweat. I do the same thing only usually toward the 15 team format. It makes sense when you prep for particular formats that it colors your thoughts on certain players.

Funny - I re-read your comments again and laughed. I can see you are waiting this year. Actually, I don't blame you and in my two early 15 team drafts I waited on 2B both times. In one draft I came away with T Nishioka and in the other I got G Beckham (who was my target in both once I decided to wait). I agree with your thinking, and if I had to choose one position to wait on in this year's draft it would be 2B. I do like both Cano, Utley and Pedroia and if my draft unfolds in a way that choosing them makes sense I wouldn't hesitate grabbing either on of those three early. But I agree 2B seems like the scarce position that has the most depth this year.

Yes I'm def waiting on 2B this year ( but the magic of Kinsler in the Spring is creeping in ) I just feel 2B is one position I can "afford" to wait on and still not feel like the player I "get stuck" with will be a drain. Since I wait on 2B/C/SP you can kind of see where my focus is. ( which I've backed up with my picks in the current mock )

If I had to re do my list I'd do the same as you and drop Utley ( prob even lower ) but you can see from my comments I wasn't high on him already.

[deansdaddy]

Well - Steve makes point here about his rankings - and I see no problem with anyone going back and revising their lists if they want to. We aren't going to tally these votes for at least another week.

So, if you want to adjust accordingly - go for it.

[Mickey4081]

Ahhh just like many things in fantasy baseball, spring stats can play a huge part on draft day. I think sometimes we don't realize this is such a small sample size and these are only practice games and we sometimes get caught up in who's having a hot spring....I say big deal..... No matter what Kinsler does this spring, he still will always and forever into the future carry the injury risk tag along with him until he proves otherwise. We all know Kinsler is extremely talented and no hot or cold spring will change my mind otherwise. I'm not going by spring stats/playing time (Utley,Kinsler) on draft day unless it's some sort of serious injury.

[bahamamike]

Wow, I think I hate 2B, more than I do 3B......... People are going to hate my rankings

1. R Cano -Without a doubt
2. D Uggla - Low BA, but you know what he will give you, and a nice Atlanta lineup can't hurt.
3. D Pedroia - how is he going to come back,
4. Brandon Philips - Numbers have been on the decline, but he is looking for a new contract, so l
5. Rickie Weeks - finally stayed healthy
6. Ben Zobrist - Power is the key
7. Chase Utley - Obviously can be ranked and number 1 or 2, but knee problems scare me, for any of you with chronic knee problems know what I mean
8. Ian Kinsler - Big Injury Risks, hasn't stayed healthy
9. Gordon Beckham - I Love him, and can see him him in the top 5, by years end
10. Brian Roberts - Lets hope for a healthy season
11. Sean Rodriguez - I have heard a lot of talk of a 20/20 season out of him
12. Kelly Johnson

I told you my rankings were going to be different....too many of the top players for me are huge injury risks - this is one position I would rather wait on, unless someone falls to me

[deansdaddy]

bump

[Bodhizefa]

Jeez, Utley's injury really rattled me. We can't count on him any longer to be one of the best year-round keystones any longer due to his injury history. I just hope he doesn't have a drastic fall-off when he is actually healthy like so many good second basemen before him.

I digress...

1) Robinson Cano - He's the leader of the pack now at second. Yay "young" Yankees.
2) Dustin Pedroia - You can put him in the top tier if you're not worried about his health. I think he's as good as Cano, but with a bit of health risk this season.
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3) Dan Uggla - I like him plenty, but he's a three category guy. He's very good in those three cats, but still, I can't rank him higher than 3rd with that caveat. He also starts his own tier as he's just not close enough to Cano or Pedroia for my taste.
4) Brandon Phillips - I think his SB's tick back up a bit this year. I worry about his RBI chances if he continues to be the lead-off man, but I'll compensate elsewhere and gladly take the 100+ runs he'll provide in that spot.
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5) Kelly Johnson - I think he's being underrated. I love him in Arizona.
6) Ben Zobrist - He'll get more homeruns, and he (hopefully) won't tire out in a full-time role this year. His average has to be better this season as long as he's worked out and built up his legs.
7) Rickie Weeks - He and Kinsler are neck and neck for me. They've got talent to be in the 2nd tier, but both come with significant injury risks. I rank Weeks higher because he's been better more recently.
8) Ian Kinsler - Talent's there, but so is the very high injury risk.
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9) Martin Prado - Boring, but worthwhile.
10) Brian Roberts - I have back problems, and I'm right around Roberts' age. They don't go away. Bid accordingly.
11) Chase Utley - Risk vs Reward with Utley. I love him to death, but how much is he going to play this year?
12) Sean Rodriguez - I'm a fan. I think he gets tons of at bats this year (he's going to be Brignac's back-up at shortstop from what I understand, along with being the primary second baseman). Count me in as someone who thinks he could easily eclipse 15/15 with a .265 average and a good amount of Runs and RBI in what should be a pretty good line-up.

Runner-Up: Gordon Beckham - I have trouble believing he is a stud-in-waiting anymore, but there's still plenty of room for him to be a good player. I'd play cautious with him and see if I could get him on a good deal. He's got the upside to be as high as 7th or 8th in my mind.